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	<title>Comments for Historiann</title>
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	<link>http://www.historiann.com</link>
	<description>History and sexual politics, 1492 to the present</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Wed, 23 May 2012 04:25:36 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>Comment on Liberals, I say!  Liberals, all of them! by Historiann</title>
		<link>http://www.historiann.com/2012/05/18/liberals-i-say-liberals-all-of-them/comment-page-1/#comment-1020727</link>
		<dc:creator>Historiann</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 May 2012 04:25:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.historiann.com/?p=18828#comment-1020727</guid>
		<description>I think you&#039;re exactly right, Dr. C.  At least, their Pater, Bill Buckley, thought so in 1951!  In &lt;i&gt;God and Man at Yale&lt;/i&gt;, he combines a touching and rather naive faith in the authority of the faculty and our ability to influence student opinions with a rather creepy willingness to name names and call out Yale faculty members of the time by name for their supposed atheism and &quot;collectivism.&quot;  He would have fit right in with Joseph McCarthy, who was doing the same thing on a much larger stage at exactly the same time.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think you&#8217;re exactly right, Dr. C.  At least, their Pater, Bill Buckley, thought so in 1951!  In <i>God and Man at Yale</i>, he combines a touching and rather naive faith in the authority of the faculty and our ability to influence student opinions with a rather creepy willingness to name names and call out Yale faculty members of the time by name for their supposed atheism and &#8220;collectivism.&#8221;  He would have fit right in with Joseph McCarthy, who was doing the same thing on a much larger stage at exactly the same time.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Liberals, I say!  Liberals, all of them! by Doctor Cleveland</title>
		<link>http://www.historiann.com/2012/05/18/liberals-i-say-liberals-all-of-them/comment-page-1/#comment-1020714</link>
		<dc:creator>Doctor Cleveland</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 May 2012 03:15:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.historiann.com/?p=18828#comment-1020714</guid>
		<description>Sorry to miss the ironies, Historiann. My only excuse is that I&#039;d been reading the more recent post about that idiotic bigot&#039;s twitter feed, and my sense of irony had been undone.

I would like to agree with you that the greatest writers were personally experimental and/or progressive, and I would like even more to agree that their experimental and progressive tendencies are what made their works great. But I&#039;m afraid the truth is probably that I am personally a liberal, and so tend to remember and emphasize the liberal or proto-liberal tendencies in writers whose works I love. *My* Dickens is a progressive social reformer, which is true enough. But I(automatically, unconsciously) neglect the other aspects of Dickens that I find less congenial. I can focus, without trying in the least, on the single issue in the universe on which Yeats and I can agree (Irish independence), and filter out his superstitious fascist-sympathizer nitwittery. Everybody does this, more or less. It&#039;s part of our response to literature. The cultural authority of great writers is so compelling, that we naturally want to recruit them to our own cause.

This is what the whole &quot;Death of the Author&quot; thing in literary studies is about, on one level: the attempt to break up a little of that Great Writer authority, and to make them seem less oracular.

What the right wing is really so upset about, I think, is that we&#039;re NOT using English class to indoctrinate students with *conservative* ideas. What they would like is for us to talk about the Great Authors and their Values, in ways that uphold the conservative worldview. And in fact, university English classes used to do just that, in living memory. The conservatives are upset that we don&#039;t do more of it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sorry to miss the ironies, Historiann. My only excuse is that I&#8217;d been reading the more recent post about that idiotic bigot&#8217;s twitter feed, and my sense of irony had been undone.</p>
<p>I would like to agree with you that the greatest writers were personally experimental and/or progressive, and I would like even more to agree that their experimental and progressive tendencies are what made their works great. But I&#8217;m afraid the truth is probably that I am personally a liberal, and so tend to remember and emphasize the liberal or proto-liberal tendencies in writers whose works I love. *My* Dickens is a progressive social reformer, which is true enough. But I(automatically, unconsciously) neglect the other aspects of Dickens that I find less congenial. I can focus, without trying in the least, on the single issue in the universe on which Yeats and I can agree (Irish independence), and filter out his superstitious fascist-sympathizer nitwittery. Everybody does this, more or less. It&#8217;s part of our response to literature. The cultural authority of great writers is so compelling, that we naturally want to recruit them to our own cause.</p>
<p>This is what the whole &#8220;Death of the Author&#8221; thing in literary studies is about, on one level: the attempt to break up a little of that Great Writer authority, and to make them seem less oracular.</p>
<p>What the right wing is really so upset about, I think, is that we&#8217;re NOT using English class to indoctrinate students with *conservative* ideas. What they would like is for us to talk about the Great Authors and their Values, in ways that uphold the conservative worldview. And in fact, university English classes used to do just that, in living memory. The conservatives are upset that we don&#8217;t do more of it.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Liberals, I say!  Liberals, all of them! by Historiann</title>
		<link>http://www.historiann.com/2012/05/18/liberals-i-say-liberals-all-of-them/comment-page-1/#comment-1020602</link>
		<dc:creator>Historiann</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 May 2012 22:35:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.historiann.com/?p=18828#comment-1020602</guid>
		<description>Doctor Cleveland, I completely agree with you that it&#039;s very difficult to fit historical authors into our contemporary political definitions.  This post was somewhat tongue-in-cheek, esp. w/r/t Hawthorne as a Democrat (with the implication being that Democrats = liberals, when in the 1840s and 50s they were of course the reactionary/conservative party.)  But then, there&#039;s that whole Brook Farm chapter of his life, and the fact that many in that Concord crowd were effectively proto-hippies.  (And Emerson really did leave large bills laying around the Alcott household because he felt sorry for Bronson&#039;s hapless wife and growing family of daughers after Bronson left teaching and wrote only unpublishable crazzy stuff while letting his wife and daughters--and Emerson--support him.)

But still:  it is a curious fact that most of our most revered writers in the canon today were expermental in the way they chose to live their lives, and/or progressive in the ideas that they wove into their most famous novels and essays.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Doctor Cleveland, I completely agree with you that it&#8217;s very difficult to fit historical authors into our contemporary political definitions.  This post was somewhat tongue-in-cheek, esp. w/r/t Hawthorne as a Democrat (with the implication being that Democrats = liberals, when in the 1840s and 50s they were of course the reactionary/conservative party.)  But then, there&#8217;s that whole Brook Farm chapter of his life, and the fact that many in that Concord crowd were effectively proto-hippies.  (And Emerson really did leave large bills laying around the Alcott household because he felt sorry for Bronson&#8217;s hapless wife and growing family of daughers after Bronson left teaching and wrote only unpublishable crazzy stuff while letting his wife and daughters&#8211;and Emerson&#8211;support him.)</p>
<p>But still:  it is a curious fact that most of our most revered writers in the canon today were expermental in the way they chose to live their lives, and/or progressive in the ideas that they wove into their most famous novels and essays.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Liberals, I say!  Liberals, all of them! by Doctor Cleveland</title>
		<link>http://www.historiann.com/2012/05/18/liberals-i-say-liberals-all-of-them/comment-page-1/#comment-1020550</link>
		<dc:creator>Doctor Cleveland</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 May 2012 19:52:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.historiann.com/?p=18828#comment-1020550</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m with you on 95% of this post, Historiann. But I&#039;d be hesitant to label all of the writers you name as &quot;liberals,&quot; and just as hesitant to name all of the writers J. Otto lists as &quot;conservative.&quot; It&#039;s not that I don&#039;t believe in long-standing liberal and conservative traditions. It&#039;s that these figures don&#039;t fit neatly into the boxes marked &quot;liberal&quot; and &quot;conservative&quot; in 2012.

Part of this might be because I teach figures from an earlier era, whose imagine the terms of political debate very differently. (Is Milton a liberal? A conservative? A radical? Yeah.) But you know &quot;Hawthorne was a democrat&quot; means &quot;Hawthorne was a close friend and supporter of Franklin Pierce,&quot; which necessarily akin to supporting Obama. And Hemingway might be considered a &quot;conservative&quot; on the basis of his racism, sexism, anti-Semitism and homophobia, if one considers those things as the core elements of conservatism, but I&#039;d prefer not to. Certainly, supporting the Republican side of the Spanish Civil War was not a big conservative move.

I did recently teach Stowe to undergraduates. And certainly, Stowe doesn&#039;t fit easily into our current categories about politics and race. In fact, I was teaching her precisely because she is hard to fit into our current terms of debate. The racial politics of Uncle Tom&#039;s Cabin really are their own thing, not ours.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m with you on 95% of this post, Historiann. But I&#8217;d be hesitant to label all of the writers you name as &#8220;liberals,&#8221; and just as hesitant to name all of the writers J. Otto lists as &#8220;conservative.&#8221; It&#8217;s not that I don&#8217;t believe in long-standing liberal and conservative traditions. It&#8217;s that these figures don&#8217;t fit neatly into the boxes marked &#8220;liberal&#8221; and &#8220;conservative&#8221; in 2012.</p>
<p>Part of this might be because I teach figures from an earlier era, whose imagine the terms of political debate very differently. (Is Milton a liberal? A conservative? A radical? Yeah.) But you know &#8220;Hawthorne was a democrat&#8221; means &#8220;Hawthorne was a close friend and supporter of Franklin Pierce,&#8221; which necessarily akin to supporting Obama. And Hemingway might be considered a &#8220;conservative&#8221; on the basis of his racism, sexism, anti-Semitism and homophobia, if one considers those things as the core elements of conservatism, but I&#8217;d prefer not to. Certainly, supporting the Republican side of the Spanish Civil War was not a big conservative move.</p>
<p>I did recently teach Stowe to undergraduates. And certainly, Stowe doesn&#8217;t fit easily into our current categories about politics and race. In fact, I was teaching her precisely because she is hard to fit into our current terms of debate. The racial politics of Uncle Tom&#8217;s Cabin really are their own thing, not ours.</p>
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		<title>Comment on If online education is the answer, what&#8217;s the question? by Jakebnto</title>
		<link>http://www.historiann.com/2012/04/29/if-online-education-is-the-answer-whats-the-question/comment-page-1/#comment-1020545</link>
		<dc:creator>Jakebnto</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 May 2012 19:38:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.historiann.com/?p=18705#comment-1020545</guid>
		<description>The key is in your second paragraph, where you speak of return. You misunderstand the purpose both of &quot;online education and/or for profit universities&quot; and the legislation/policy that encourages same: to whit, the return is measured in how much the business makes, not how well the students are taught or how they do as a tool of production once they actually matriculate.

Those few who DO matriculate.

It&#039;s all about the money. It always is.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The key is in your second paragraph, where you speak of return. You misunderstand the purpose both of &#8220;online education and/or for profit universities&#8221; and the legislation/policy that encourages same: to whit, the return is measured in how much the business makes, not how well the students are taught or how they do as a tool of production once they actually matriculate.</p>
<p>Those few who DO matriculate.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s all about the money. It always is.</p>
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		<title>Comment on My fantasy by Indyanna</title>
		<link>http://www.historiann.com/2012/05/11/my-fantasy/comment-page-1/#comment-1020540</link>
		<dc:creator>Indyanna</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 May 2012 19:31:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.historiann.com/?p=18782#comment-1020540</guid>
		<description>Wow, I don&#039;t want to claim to be the only person on the planet--or maybe even the only person on this blog--to predict the Facebook IPO implosion, but I will say this as the slide continues through a third trading day: I&#039;m glad I kept well over a third of my endowment on an index of leading U.S. steelmakers!  I think I may order a few quire of paper stationery and a self-filling fountain pen!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wow, I don&#8217;t want to claim to be the only person on the planet&#8211;or maybe even the only person on this blog&#8211;to predict the Facebook IPO implosion, but I will say this as the slide continues through a third trading day: I&#8217;m glad I kept well over a third of my endowment on an index of leading U.S. steelmakers!  I think I may order a few quire of paper stationery and a self-filling fountain pen!</p>
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		<title>Comment on Your free laugh today:  George Tierney of Greenville, South Carolina by Lance</title>
		<link>http://www.historiann.com/2012/05/21/your-free-laugh-today-george-tierney-of-greenville-south-carolina/comment-page-1/#comment-1020497</link>
		<dc:creator>Lance</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 May 2012 17:38:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.historiann.com/?p=18839#comment-1020497</guid>
		<description>He closed his Twitter account.  Sigh.  I will miss the pottymouth of George Tierney of Greenville, South Carolina.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>He closed his Twitter account.  Sigh.  I will miss the pottymouth of George Tierney of Greenville, South Carolina.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Your free laugh today:  George Tierney of Greenville, South Carolina by J. Otto Pohl</title>
		<link>http://www.historiann.com/2012/05/21/your-free-laugh-today-george-tierney-of-greenville-south-carolina/comment-page-1/#comment-1020490</link>
		<dc:creator>J. Otto Pohl</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 May 2012 17:11:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.historiann.com/?p=18839#comment-1020490</guid>
		<description>Trust me your blog has several orders of magnitude more readers than does mine.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Trust me your blog has several orders of magnitude more readers than does mine.</p>
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		<title>Comment on My fantasy by Jakebnto</title>
		<link>http://www.historiann.com/2012/05/11/my-fantasy/comment-page-1/#comment-1020469</link>
		<dc:creator>Jakebnto</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 May 2012 16:18:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.historiann.com/?p=18782#comment-1020469</guid>
		<description>Truffula, no matter how much book shelf you have, the number of books will expand to occupy the available space. It&#039;s like a rule or something.

Speaking from experience.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Truffula, no matter how much book shelf you have, the number of books will expand to occupy the available space. It&#8217;s like a rule or something.</p>
<p>Speaking from experience.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Your free laugh today:  George Tierney of Greenville, South Carolina by Historiann</title>
		<link>http://www.historiann.com/2012/05/21/your-free-laugh-today-george-tierney-of-greenville-south-carolina/comment-page-1/#comment-1020451</link>
		<dc:creator>Historiann</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 May 2012 15:26:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.historiann.com/?p=18839#comment-1020451</guid>
		<description>Wow--that&#039;s pretty cutting-edge web design, for 1994.

This whole thing reminds me of when Dr. Laura Schlessinger both  insisted that her bare nekkid pRony pictures weren&#039;t her while simultaneously demanding that the internets give her pictures back to her.  All of them.  

But that was back in the 1990s, which gives her more of an excuse I think than George Tierney of Greenville, South Carolina.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wow&#8211;that&#8217;s pretty cutting-edge web design, for 1994.</p>
<p>This whole thing reminds me of when Dr. Laura Schlessinger both  insisted that her bare nekkid pRony pictures weren&#8217;t her while simultaneously demanding that the internets give her pictures back to her.  All of them.  </p>
<p>But that was back in the 1990s, which gives her more of an excuse I think than George Tierney of Greenville, South Carolina.</p>
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