Comments on: On being (politely) called a pain in the a$$

By: Gender and performance in grad school : Historiann : History and sexual politics, 1492 to the present

Sat, 25 Jun 2011 14:53:17 +0000

[...] I told her to get used to being called a pushy b!tch. It’s just what happens when you’re a woman with an opinion, so do what you need to [...]

By: Rae

Rae — Tue, 31 May 2011 01:41:41 +0000

I’m an (female) undergraduate history major right now and I think many many of my professors are intimidating but selectively so. By that I mean, one professors loved anyone that spoke Polish, but I, do not, so I was often referred to wikipedia when I asked a question. I will admit that I find most of my male professors intimidating while my female professors and TAs generally are more approachable (and I, therefore, go to their office hours more). But I have had really wonderful and easy to talk to professors, both male and female.

What I think makes someone intimidating is if they think you are stupid. By that I mean, the Polish lover made it clear that he thought I was stupid (once describing a thesis to me as an “argument,” like I was 2 years old) and he was, therefore, intimidating to me. While other professors allow me to ask questions and don’t look at me like a moron, I tend to think of them as less intimidating. So, for me it’s not really a male or female thing but rather if I leave feeling as if the person thinks that I am not totally mentally deficient.

By: Indyanna

Indyanna — Fri, 27 May 2011 06:17:06 +0000

@ John S. So, Historiann being only one of the *two* most willful students in the second generation could be sort of used as another proof for the old “declension” formula we thought we had done with hearing?

The “permissive” adverb resonates with my recollection of the experience in the same shop in a different era than either you or Historiann. The “Jesuitical” one not so much, or not at all, but then I’m not sure I ever knew what that term of art referred to.

By: Historiann

Historiann — Thu, 26 May 2011 22:19:09 +0000

One of the awesome things about age and experience is letting other people take responsibility for their own feelings. You gotta be you, -k-.

By: -k-

-k- — Thu, 26 May 2011 22:04:02 +0000

I’m ‘intimidating’ as well (though, like Janice, am often smiling, and like Sensible, rarely go for long without cracking a joke). I’m pretty sure it’s about the confidence, which is ironic given that, much to my dismay, I appear to have something of a complex about this. I do my best to be vigilant but still catch myself in mid-execution of wholly unnatural vocal and grammatical contortions, the result of attempts by the command center’s attempts to avoid ‘making’ people feel that way. This is rarely done convincingly, because it’s not who I am.

(Minus the particular details, my grad school trajectory was very similar. Pain and misery, growing success, getting the hell out and on to life.)

By: Katherine

Katherine — Thu, 26 May 2011 13:41:44 +0000

yes, I think not maternal is key, and it has different significance if you are a not maternal male vs. a not maternal female. In general I think it is better to be an intimidating male than female. And Historiann I think you are right it is about shifting responsibilities away from the person who is intimidated.

By: Sensible

Sensible — Thu, 26 May 2011 13:21:53 +0000

I’ve frequently been called intimidating by students in end of semester evaluations. (And I am so goofy in class!) I think Katherine’s point about smart and authoritative is on target, as is Ruth’s about performing femininity adequately. I really think, at least in my context, they go together: “intimidating” codes “smart and authoritative” in conjunction with “not maternal.”

By: Historiann

Historiann — Thu, 26 May 2011 12:49:46 +0000

“I noticed the bar is set low for women–all you have to be is smart and authoritative.” Word.

I guess what I also find striking is that calling someone “intimidating” is a way of shifting the responsibility for one’s reaction to a person onto that person, assigning hir responsibility for others’ choices about how to feel. I have found some people in my life intimidating–but I assumed that it was my problem to figure out if I needed to work with them productively.

I guess I really bristle at the word sometimes, because I was once informed by a Dean that I had to understand that I was “intimidating” to people in my department, although I was untenured, and also the youngest and most junior person there. IOW, I was charged with fixing people’s reactions to me although that’s the complete opposite of how power really works.

By: Katherine

Katherine — Thu, 26 May 2011 12:40:02 +0000

I’m struck by how most of the accusations of willfulness seem to be coming from male advisers. But I also think it is interesting that male graduate students and male professors also get called willful, or when they grow up intimidating. I had a female adviser, who never, as far as I know referred to her students in such terms. I also have been called an intimidating professor, but when I compare myself to the males who has similar reputations, I noticed the bar is set low for women–all you have to be is smart and authoritative.

By: thefrogprincess

thefrogprincess — Wed, 25 May 2011 22:31:09 +0000

Yeah, there’s something about being done wrong and reacting accordingly (whether it be with crippling depression or boiling rage or both at the same time) that turns the female victim into a willful, insubordinate ingrate. I know this dynamic well. My grad school experience has also been hellacious, and until this year, when my colleagues find themselves without jobs and are suddenly on the bandwagon of how there’s something wrong, I was the ungrateful pain in the ass who wouldn’t allow others to enjoy the lovely time they were all having and that I deserved. (I’m exaggerating somewhat, but only somewhat.)

It’s amazing how that works: speaking up about mistreatment, refusing to accept the BS, and you become an unfeminine, emasculating woman who won’t find a man unless you femme up and become more damsel-in-distress. (Also something I’ve been told, by a gay man who should know better.)