Comments on: “Students of the digital age” put one over on their proffies http://www.historiann.com/2010/08/02/students-of-the-digital-age-put-one-over-on-their-proffies/ History and sexual politics, 1492 to the present Mon, 22 Sep 2014 04:23:22 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.9.2 By: Thursday Links « Interrobangs Anonymous http://www.historiann.com/2010/08/02/students-of-the-digital-age-put-one-over-on-their-proffies/comment-page-1/#comment-686358 Thu, 12 Aug 2010 04:12:17 +0000 http://www.historiann.com/?p=12016#comment-686358 [...] a great discussion of plagiarism in academia, and what drives it, over at Historiann. The comments are well worth reading, and I (Millie) am [...]

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By: Clay Boggess http://www.historiann.com/2010/08/02/students-of-the-digital-age-put-one-over-on-their-proffies/comment-page-1/#comment-680757 Thu, 05 Aug 2010 12:57:35 +0000 http://www.historiann.com/?p=12016#comment-680757 Plagiarism is a character flaw that will eventually be found out regardless. Time is the great neutralizer.

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By: Western Dave http://www.historiann.com/2010/08/02/students-of-the-digital-age-put-one-over-on-their-proffies/comment-page-1/#comment-679650 Wed, 04 Aug 2010 02:52:18 +0000 http://www.historiann.com/?p=12016#comment-679650 @like a fox, if you are serious about that assignment, have them do the outline. And for students who use on-line research organizing programs such as the really excellent (and cheap!) program noodlebib; you’ll have to figure out some work arounds with them.

It would be much easier to just require everybody to take their notes for research paper in noodlebib, (or by hand) and then have them turn the notes in with the project. Noodlebib has the ability to let you see the notes as they create them and gives students the ability to tag and sort. We now require it for all our upper school students and it really helps. The program also allows you to clearly note on the same card a quote, a paraphrase, and “my ideas.”

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By: FrauTech http://www.historiann.com/2010/08/02/students-of-the-digital-age-put-one-over-on-their-proffies/comment-page-1/#comment-679306 Tue, 03 Aug 2010 18:23:04 +0000 http://www.historiann.com/?p=12016#comment-679306 Well in some fields diligence from the Professor can stop plagiarism. In engineering we are informed verbally that copying the answers from a solutions manual or from the internet is cheating. However, nearly every class the professor gets the first homework assignment, then makes a speech about how so many students directly copied the homework, but how he/she isn’t phased because homework is “only 10% of your grade” and so the cheaters are hurting themselves for the exam. I’m not sure about that. A “free” 10% to your grade, and people who are looking at the solutions to the problems when doing the homework the first time around. Versus the rest of us who don’t cheat, turn it in, get 5%, and then seeing the solutions (usually posted) requires several extra hours to get out of it what the cheaters got. One of my last classes the professor taught without requiring the textbook, which meant he “made up” homework problems every week. I’d think that would be the best solution, or like all of you in composition fields have stated, make sure you’re asking for requirements that can’t just be copied from the internet, or using sources that are not often written about. Usually though, most teachers/professors are too overworked/lazy to bother with preventative measures so students have a “learned behavior” of cheating to some degree. Historiann is right, it’s lack of investment in our education system.

I also think ease plays a part. I remember taking a closed notes/closed book exam and I trotted off to the bathroom thinking about a problem that was bothering me. It was some topic I had learned but had forgotten, so it was irritatingly close to me being able to remember but I just couldn’t. Then I realized I had walked off with my smartphone in my pocket. It took a bit of effort to keep walking and not do anything. I ended up failing that class, but I’m really glad I didn’t give in to temptation. However, it was so easy and there would have been almost no chance of anyone knowing. That’s the problem with technology is when it makes it too easy. And an unprepared student makes it that much worse.

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By: Clio Bluestocking http://www.historiann.com/2010/08/02/students-of-the-digital-age-put-one-over-on-their-proffies/comment-page-1/#comment-679033 Tue, 03 Aug 2010 12:04:36 +0000 http://www.historiann.com/?p=12016#comment-679033 Historiann, true, the majority of my students were not prepped for college in the same way as those you mentioned; and I do get so incredibly frustrated. Some days, I think I am completely ill-equipped for my job.

I’m afraid I do occasionally take my frustration out on them; but they are set up. Really, the school systems, even the better ones, focus so much on that crowd control and teaching to the test that they make the students afraid to have a thought. Or they allow the students to get away with plaigairism because their teachers are stretched too thin to check. Or the concept of being educated gets lost in the quest to get high test scores on the part of the schools and a credential on the part of the students.

Then, when the students get to our college, they are dumped into humanities and social science classes without being required to take even the first semester of writing, which sets everyone up to fail. Every year I have to assume fewer and fewer basic skills, and less and less basic knowlege. Despite claims to the contrary, we do have to be Grade 13 or college prep just as much as we have to be college.

Again, digital age has nothing to do with it. Not funding education so that teachers are not overworked and students get more resources and attention does.

Ah, jeez, now I’m depressed!

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By: Bit Bot http://www.historiann.com/2010/08/02/students-of-the-digital-age-put-one-over-on-their-proffies/comment-page-1/#comment-678839 Tue, 03 Aug 2010 04:14:30 +0000 http://www.historiann.com/?p=12016#comment-678839 Ignatz–actually

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By: likeafox http://www.historiann.com/2010/08/02/students-of-the-digital-age-put-one-over-on-their-proffies/comment-page-1/#comment-678815 Tue, 03 Aug 2010 03:13:59 +0000 http://www.historiann.com/?p=12016#comment-678815 I have not assigned a research paper in years because of plagiarism. What I do is require an essay on the reading each week and a discussion in front of the other students. Only works in classes of less than 20. I require cumulative writing, comparing the last book to the current one so for the most part my graduate students read the assignments. After reading this enlightening listserv I am going to require students to do research for a research papers but write the essay in class during the exam period. A proctor will make sure they are not online. In fact a better idea is that they bring the physical notes and write by hand. No computers, no drafts, no internet. Just a brain and a pile of print outs. Oh, a razor and a bottle of paste for including historical evidence in the written document. Haha. Finally, hand written footnotes. I don’t know if this will work but I am going to try it out.

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By: Ignatz http://www.historiann.com/2010/08/02/students-of-the-digital-age-put-one-over-on-their-proffies/comment-page-1/#comment-678804 Tue, 03 Aug 2010 02:48:11 +0000 http://www.historiann.com/?p=12016#comment-678804 Hear, hear, everybody.
I encountered particular difficulty as a composition teacher with students from other countries stitching together papers from a mishmash of sources. (I tutored one foreign student whose paper was such a mashup that I blurted out, “Where did you get this?” Unfazed, he replied, “From a bunch of books.”) I doubt other countries encourage their scholars to lift portions of text from elsewhere without attribution…Many were grad students. I think they simply did not have the skills to put together and support an argument in English, so they panicked. Basically, I blame universities– for setting the TOEFL bar low and using foreign grad students as cash cows. Genormous Flagship U, where I got my PhD, was egregious.

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By: Historiann http://www.historiann.com/2010/08/02/students-of-the-digital-age-put-one-over-on-their-proffies/comment-page-1/#comment-678781 Tue, 03 Aug 2010 02:21:34 +0000 http://www.historiann.com/?p=12016#comment-678781 But Clio–your students are really, really different from Tony’s, Tenured Radical’s, or even my students. Your students weren’t the beneficiaries (for the most part) of a college prep education, or so I gather. (Please correct me if this isn’t so.)

That said–I hear your frustration in dealing with students who can’t grasp the concept of original expression versus statements of fact. I see less evil in their hearts than in the hearts of my students, the vast majority of whom as plagiarists get that but are too lazy to do the work honestly.

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By: Clio Bluestocking http://www.historiann.com/2010/08/02/students-of-the-digital-age-put-one-over-on-their-proffies/comment-page-1/#comment-678776 Tue, 03 Aug 2010 01:56:50 +0000 http://www.historiann.com/?p=12016#comment-678776 Crowd control and standardized testing, I imagine, Comrade PhysioProf.

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